smoking ban - who enforces

[Denewood]

I fully support the smoking ban, but I find there is no official organization to help hoteliers, if guests smoke in rooms, who cares, unless you take small claims court action, which a lot of hassle. It would be nice to know some one cared. Or a procedure that can be used help hoteliers stop guests smoking.
The costs are quite horrendous, one guest disconnected our alarm system, is cost nearly £500 to sort out the problem, and we can not trace which guest it was, so we bear the cost.
Any ideas would be nice to know.

[Wiggy]

I try my hardest to keep notices and rules to a minimum as they can be unsightly and intimidating to guests. I do however have a notice in each room informing the occupants that all guests safety is of paramount importance and that anyone found smokng in their room will be asked to leave at once. I also add that no refund will be given. The smell of smoking can be easily noticed even I as a smoker can detect it. This, touch wood, seems to do the trick and as yet I have not encountered any problems.

[Rolando]

The local Environmental Health dept enforce these regulations, they got extra funding when they were introduced to employ additional enforcement officers. In practice it would be impossible for them to enforce this rule in a letting room.

[Raincliffe1]

I feel really sorry for you because this story shows how devious smokers can be and yes - you have to bear the cost. You might have people arriving for a room which a person has smoked in and left. The new occupant might refuse to take the room because they booked under the condition you were a non-smoking establishment, if you have no other room to offer them they could walk away to another hotel - you might have just lost a £800.00 booking. It is a question of how watertight do you need to make your 'terms and conditions' to cover every eventuality presented to you by those who disregard the rules and smoke.

This week I had a young chap from a firm called T***O who put up exhibition equipment - ths is no reflection on the firm but this guy blatantly had been smoking in the bedroom, cigarette stubs on the outside windowsill, piles of cigarette ash scattered on the inner windowsill, half smoked cigarette ends in the bin, room smelling like an ashtray. When he came back to pick some clothes up I said 'next time go and smoke in somebody else's hotel' to which he replied 'I didn't smoke', I felt like saying 'yeah and I've got 10 heads' I also felt like taking all his cigarette ends and ash and shoving it in with his clean clothes (here's something else you forgot!) but I didn't because hoteliers are civilised people...

I spoke with my local council about this and basically unless you catch them physically smoking there is nothing you can do. Earlier this year 2 women were smoking in the bedroom (my neighbour alerted me) I went straight upstairs, opened the door and told them to leave, plus we charged them a cancellation fee - they called me every name under the sun. These people risk the safety of all the other people in the building but hey they don't care.

If you do catch them you can always tell them to stop smoking, we prefer ejecting them from the premises as it ensures peace of mind but you still lose out financially.

We have in the past taken card details from smokers and told them if they smoke in the room they will also be liable for the cost of cleaning curtains etc and also any lost bookngs; I could have done this with the young chap but it was his bosses card details and who is his boss going to side with? Plus they would never send any of their custom my way again. You just cannot win. When you see or speak to people you just have to make split second decisions (are you going to respect my premises and my other customers or not?) and occasionally we get it wrong.

[Andy Banner-Price]

Hi
We run a small country house (www.plasdinas.co.uk).
We had a chap who was smoking in his room. I could smell it in the morning in our newly decorated corridors and was really annoyed. When he went downstairs for breakfast I checked his room and found cigarette butts hidden in tissue in the bin. I confrunted him after breakfast and explained I would need to charge an extra night's stay. This is our policy and is stated in our T&Cs on the internet, when they book they also agree to our T&Cs and when they arrive they sign the Registration card which again says they agree to our T&Cs. We explain that if we are unable to let the room the next night as it needs airing and perhaps items washing, then they will pay for this.
The guy went mad about it but I took it from his credit card anyway.
A few weeks later, I had a letter from his bank disputing the charges and asking for more detail. I had luckily kept the evidence! So I sent them a photo of the evidence, a photo of the no smoking sign on the front door and the one in his room, plus a copy of our T&Cs and the form he had signed.
The bank sided with us and agreed it was a ligitimate charge!
If you have been fair to the customer and been very clear about your policy, both for smoking and what you do as a result of rule breaking then you have every right to charge.
Hope this helps.
Andy.

[Raincliffe1]

Thanks Andy, I see what your saying but you still did not personally witness him smoking even though the evidence was there. They can still turn around and say 'I was not smoking/the last guest left it there' etc (even if you personally cleaned the room as I do). One guest even told us he found a smoking cigarette butt on the window sill to which my husband replied, 'have the seagulls took up smoking now?'. Yes, we have had very irate people whom we have charged because they have smoked but the bottom line is either way you are drawn into a slanging match with them or their bank or at worst on a hotel review site where they are obviously economical with the full version of events and paint you in a bad light. Moreover, I am on my own on the premises 6 months of the year and do not really want a confrontation of this kind with my guests but then again if they put a cigarette burn through a £75.00 duvet cover or burnt the building down... Either way, people smoking are a total headache.

[Sue & Dave]

Its good to find out how other establishments tackle this problem.

Some times it is difficult to detect if a guest has been smoking in your house or if its just the smog they've brought inside with them from the quick smoke outside. Its nearly caught us out a few times, but you have to be sure and dont say anything rash. Usually the smokers are happy to smoke outside, I do feel sorry for them if its raining though.

We've had one or two smokers in our bedrooms even though we inform all customers that we have a non-smoking policy in our establishment. We have two of the No Smoking By Law signs ( I put one in the wrong place but it will make the paint work if I remove it!!) and the T&C's are written on the bedroom tariff.
If the guests have booked by phone OR the internet we send them a written confirmation with the T&C plainly written (its been checked by The Federation of Small Businesses) and we quote a £50 charge for smokers just to cover the cost of cleaning. You got to clean the curtains, bedcovers and any soft furnishings to try and rid taht awful smell. Well, Hotels do it so why not the smaller guys. BUT you must display a "Smoking in a room Causes Damage ... fine of £50:00, etc., " for it to be legal. You also have to point it out to your guests when showing them to the room. Its a drag (oops soory no pun intended) I know but it really does cover you from any potential pit falls.

I can strongly recommend that every join an organisation like the Federation of Small Businesses to help out with any legal difficulties. They have been very helpful.

Hope we've added to the knowledge base.

Dave F

[sagefarm]

Does self catering accomodation come under the new legislation making it illegal to smoke in a public place? We have no smoking signs in our cottages and on our website but can we enforce the law regardless of any signs or notices?

[Carol Girling]

I have been reliable infomed that once a person books a room they are entitled to smoke if they wish, even if you state the no smoking rule, something to do with them owning the room for the duration of their stay!!

I am a smoker and would never dream of not complying to peoples wishes.

[Town guest house]

There is nothing illegal about guests smoking in bedrooms. It is up to the individual establishment to decide whether to allow or not allow, for all or any of the bedrooms.
That said, it is the phrasing of the T&Cs and the implied conditions of the contract made between the owner and the guest which cover damage that encompass smoking. That's why it is a civil matter.
We allow, but discourage, smoking and have FAR more trouble with the 'damage' caused by take-away-food, biro, nail varnish and the rest. Very, very rarely has a guest commented that the room they checked in to 'smelled of cigarettes' and luckily we have always been able to move them.
Good housekeeping and Fabreeze solve a lot of ills!

A life-long non-smoker

[Jacinta]

I find smokers a complete nightmare, the ones that smoke in bedrooms that is. One guest when confronted said that he was not smoking in the room , he was smoking out of the window!! I have confronted people on many occasions and have been responded to by complete denial. Sometimes I doubt myself and think I am losing my mind. When they sign in now I have added to the registeration form that they agree with the no smoking policy. Fingers crossed. I can smell smokers when they come to the door and now I tell them that they will have to leave mmediately if they smoke........so far so good. I try to run a lighthearted and friendly establishment but get very downhearted when people do not respect my home and hospitality

[bobbriggs]

The smoking ban in 2007 created a problem for us as we were already for non smokers. Once the ban cam in all assumed accommodation had to allow smokers to stay but they must smoke outside. The right to smoke is not recognised in law so just as there exists places for adults so no children,places without pets and gay friendly places the accommodation provider can choose not to allow smokers to stay in their accommodation. Trouble is everyone just assumes smokers can stay so an article has been written debating the difference between accommodation for non smokers [where all who stay are non smokers] and non smoking accommodation where smokers stay but must by law smoke outside. See our website www.swisscottagebedandbreakfast.co.uk click any no smoking logo. If you want a mention in the article which is dynamic please let me know say if you to do not allow smokers accommodation.

Kind regards,

Bob
Swiss Cottage

[Samantha]

We have always operated a strict 'No Smoking' policy within our premises and have on occasions charged guests for an extra nights stay as they have smoked in their rooms( as per our policy which is outlined on the Guest Registration Form). The majority of these guests have admitted to smoking in the room once we confront them about it.
The problem arises when guests blatantly deny they have been smoking even when you have the evidence and they refuse to pay the 'extra cleaning charge'. Has anyone ever taken the issue further?

[freddy1]

Hello Samanatha, I have taken smoking issues further on a few occassions. The first was when we had not been open long but have from the start never allowed smoking inside the building. A woman decided to smoke in her bedroom out of the window and flick ash all over my plants and I can smell smoke 3 floors up! I asked her to leave immediately at breakfast time and charged her for 2 nights stay as she had booked that. She didn't like it and complainted to the local tourist board but I really couldn't have cared less. Her friend didn't walk out to back her up either which I thought was rather odd - what a friend to have! The woman said she didn't know it was a no smoking establishment but it was all over our website and on confirmation docs - I really have no time for those who claim they didn't know. The second time was about 2 years ago when a man stayed in our single room - I could smell the smoke coming from the room on the first floor; the room stunk of smoke when he left and he was extremely abusive by saying he didn't like being accused of doing something he didn't do. I called his boss and told her and topped it off by telling her that he was also breaking the law by smoking in their company car in our carpark (well, cross me and I'll lay in on as thick as possible), then got a letter from the company director apologising profusily. Why is it that smokers think they are smarter than the average bear eh? I get thumbs up from non-smokers who understand that we could also lose our home as it is against the insurance policy so any claim involving smoking would not be paid (and smokers STILL don't get it).

Perhaps I may be a bit harsh but it is our home and I have not intention of losing it because of some idiot and his filthy habit.

[Samantha]

Hi Freddy
Thanks for your response..
I have recently had an incident where a couple stayed with us for one night and we found evidence (after they had checked out) that someone had been smoking several cigarettes in the bathroom. I rang the wife and stated that we knew someone had been smoking in the room and she denied it.
I told her that I knew that our No Smoking Policy had been emphasied on check-in, they had signed our check-in form which outlines the policy and I stated that there are No Smoking signs around the property. I advised her that there was an extra cleaning charge which initially she refused to pay. I stated that I would be speaking to Enforcement Officer in Environmental Health and my Solicitor and I would take this matter further. I told her if they agreed to pay promptly I would reduce the charge. She then offered cash for half the amount (of my reduced offer)-which I turned down. After further discussion she said she could not be bothered with "this" and asked if I could take a card payment. I took payment.
This was not the end of the matter however as she has requestied half the money back as she believed that she only agreed to pay the amount she had offered in cash. I said that was not my understanding at all - I would not have agreed to the settlement for such a reduced amount.
The woman has stated that she will contact her card company and request half the money back but I told her my understanding would be that the card company investigate why the money is withdrawn - she said she did not want to do this.
I have sent her a letter detailing all of the above and stating that if she withdraws the money I will persue the full amount for the extra cleaning through the court. I am awaiting a response......

[Der Alte Fritz]

We had a couple staying in the last week or so and the lady was smoking on the first night so we asked her to stop and gave her a letter saying we would charge her £50 cleaning charge if she continued. She did not stop the second night so we asked her again and she finally did stop. At check out she did argue the toss although I gave her a copy of the terms and conditions, a summary of the Act downloaded from this website and a polite determination that I had her credit card details and was going to charge her card come what may. She still refused to pay and stormed out. But her partner came in from the car park and did pay the bill and we charged her card the smoking charge.

The lesson: get credit card details at check in, clear terms and conditions, early warning letter left in room, polite but firm stand in the face of abuse, hysterics, etc and a cunning gizmo in the bathroom which looks like a fire alarm but which detects cigarette smoke and then gives off a spoken message saying "Stop smoking!"

[victor221]

You can always take the patch and not smoke. That's what I do.
Its great on the plane ;)